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Post by bookemdanno on Sept 2, 2013 14:41:22 GMT
Good Luck Faz!! I've contemplated many things to get out of the 5 til 9 day job, keep it going until it takes over too much and the transition to the "own boss" life is much easier and a smaller step to take. you'll have to upscale the pizza oven soon then, eh?
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Post by faz on Sept 2, 2013 18:54:56 GMT
I did suggest building a barrel vault oven up the side of the house but the missus was having none of it! We are looking at building a bakery/workshop in the space where the car port is at the side of the house so we can increase output. Anyway, I am conscious that I have hijacked this thread so that's enough for now
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Post by cannyfradock on Sept 2, 2013 20:12:50 GMT
Hey Faz I'm sure Spinal won't mind....but your idea sounds real interesting and it commands it's own thread (I'd be truly interested). I would love to swap my own culture on this thread but after 3 failed attempts I wouldn't pass on my own sourdough on to my worst enemy. ( I might just scrounge a parcel of someone else though). I have been told that I have given up on my own sourdough levain when it may have been still active...it didn't look like to me!! As a natural sourdough takes natural yeasts from the air .....and from the previous on-going culture, I have a nagging feeling that my location (in the center of a built up location) may not be the best setting for natural yeasts in the air. Terry
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Post by faz on Sept 3, 2013 5:31:15 GMT
I think the bulk of the yeast wil be what is naturally present on the flour you feed the starter with, and once a viable culture has built up it is difficult to kill it all off. Did you keep yours in the fridge? I find mine lasts for a good few weeks in there even if I don't touch it/feed it/stir it.
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petec
WFO Team Player
Posts: 232
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Post by petec on Sept 3, 2013 9:41:34 GMT
Hi Terry
even in an urban location you should be able to get a good culture going and keep it lively. Even feeding with tap water, plain bread flour and clean but unsterilized gear it seems to survive well for me.
I've found that even with weeks and weeks of neglect in the fridge, after 3 feedings its back up to full vigour.
I can try dry some of mine and send dried by post if you like to try again ?
I haven't tried drying it out before but all the books say its a good way to send it. I'm sure you will crack it. cheers Petec
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Sept 3, 2013 11:58:44 GMT
Pete,
There shouldn't be any need to dry starter for sending in the UK. I normally just put some live starter into a ziploc bag, stick that in another ziploc just to be sure and then bung it in the post.
I think the drying process is more appropriate for places like the US where the postal service can take a while, and the temperatures can be more extreme.
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petec
WFO Team Player
Posts: 232
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Post by petec on Sept 3, 2013 13:48:55 GMT
Ah, but I dont have any ziplock bags !
Worth knowing its OK wet though - thanks.
cheers Petec
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Post by bookemdanno on Sept 3, 2013 18:39:47 GMT
That's interesting reading about how your starters have lasted for so long. That's one thing that's held me back, is the thought of another high maintenance being in the house!
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barney
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Post by barney on Sept 4, 2013 9:48:58 GMT
If you have trouble getting a starter going there are plenty of ways of beefing it up that only add to the taste. Grapes have already been mentioned on here (they have natural moulds on the skins which ferment wine), I've used a recipe that called for raisins before, presumably for the same reason; but my favourite was the one that uses the sediment from bottled conditioned beer.
For this you just go to a decent beer vendor, find some bottle conditioned beer (they leave some of the yeast in to continue the ferment) and let it settle somewhere cool for a few days. Carefully pour off most of the beer (into a glass please, wasting it is tantamount to alcohol abuse!) and add the remaining liquid containing the sediment to your starter to give it some extra zing and a unique taste.
Failure of this starter only results in the requirement to drink more beer, so it's a win-win situation!
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Post by bookemdanno on Sept 5, 2013 15:23:59 GMT
Oh yes! I like that one, and will use that as my starter....when that day comes! I have a couple of great local micro breweries, so it's just a case of eenie, meenie, minee, mo, of to the brewery i go! Thanks Barney!
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Sept 5, 2013 16:48:44 GMT
I brew my own beer - and one thing that may be helpful is that local microbreweries are often quite happy to give you a good slug of their yeast either for free or for a small donation. Might be helpful to take a small, clean lidded pot with you.
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Post by rockrocky on Sept 12, 2013 16:56:52 GMT
With many thanks again to adm. My Ischia soutdough is up and running. Here are some tips from the Fabulous Baker Brothers on looking after your dough:
How to start a sourdough culture With regular care and some forward planning a sourdough culture can provide delicious bread and pancakes for decades Share Tweet this
Email Tom and Henry Herbert theguardian.com, Monday 20 February 2012 11.00 GMT
You can go so far as to name your sourdough. Photograph: Chris Terry Starting a sourdough culture
Find a suitable container to house your sourdough. A Kilner jar is good. Clean it well and weigh it while it's empty, noting the weight on an address tag or label. (This saves you having to empty it out to know how much you have left – it'll be worth it later.)
Weigh 75g organic wholemeal or dark rye or wholemeal spelt flour into the jar (any of these will work well), then weigh in 75g/ml warm water. Stir. Leave your jar in a prominent and warm place (its second home) in your kitchen, with the lid sealed.
Each day for a week, repeat the feeding process (75g flour and 75g water, as before), stirring vigorously with a clean finger or a fork to remove all floury lumps. After about 5 days you'll notice bubbles in the dough. Like the first windy smile of a baby, you know that soon enough it'll be laughing and telling jokes, and you're on your way to the most rewarding kind of baking.
You can use the culture at this stage, but it will be slow and weak. After the first week, you can start to keep the culture in the fridge (its first home), only removing it a day or so before use, to feed it back into full bubbly liveliness (75g flour and 75g water, as before). After a month, the dough will have matured and you'll be getting great flavour and rising performance from it.
It's quite laughable just how simple it can be to keep your sourdough in peak condition for really tasty loaves, if you feed it occasionally and mostly keep it in the fridge. Surplus sourdough can be used to flavour all manner of buns, cakes and pancakes.
If the sourdough is not performing well enough, try taking it out of the fridge a day before you want to use it, and giving it an extra feed. Remember that, as a living culture, it needs to be fed if it's not hibernating in the fridge (where it can survive for several months). It likes to be warm and aerated (stirred/whisked) occasionally.
If it dies ("de-natures" – you'll know because it will smell disgusting), bin it and start again. I'm custodian of our family sourdough that's been rising award-winning loaves at Hobbs House Bakery for more than 55 years. With a bit of good husbandry and some forward planning, yours could live just as long, or longer.
Feeding a sourdough culture
Know the weight of your container so you can weigh the sourdough without creating washing up. Ideally, you should always retain at least a quarter of your sourdough so you don't dilute its flavour and performance.
Feed your sourdough more if you wish to bake more loaves or create more sourdough culture to share. This will momentarily dilute the flavour.
Sourdough culture often separates after a day or two. Just stir the grey water back in when you feed it. Keep a small quantity of sourdough frozen in case of emergency, and if necessary defrost and follow the weekly plan.
Now you have a sourdough, you can name it. I found the anthropomorphising of my sourdough culture particularly helpful when I was about to leave it in the custody of an apprentice ("baldrick").
The culture was going through a particularly virile stage and had built up a head of steam when – KABOOOM! – it blew its lid off, taking out a bulb in the overhead ultraviolet insectocutor.
It had earned its moniker, the "Monster" (it's alive, it'll bite), and I was able to make it clear to baldrick that, like the sourdough, I'd explode and put his lights out if he didn't look after it and feed it while I was away.
Weekly Plan
Once you've established your sourdough, follow this plan to have a loaf of freshly baked bread every Saturday morning. Should you want to bake more loaves, just multiply the recipe in anticipation of your bake.
1. Start with 75g of sourdough remaining, having just mixed a batch of dough.
2. Feed the culture 75g flour and 75g cold water (it will now weigh 225g), and refrigerate.
3. On Friday morning, remove the sourdough from the fridge and feed it again with 75g flour and 75g warm water. It will now weigh 375g, the target weight for this process (300g for the recipe and 75g to keep). Leave it somewhere warm.
4. On Friday evening, weigh and mix the sourdough following the instructions on your sourdough loaf recipe. You will have 75g sourdough remaining.
5. Return to step 1.
Should your sourdough culture be lacklustre and sluggish, or if you're using it for the first time after an extended hibernation in the fridge, start the weekly revival process a day early and give an additional feed.
• These recipes are extracted from The Fabulous Baker Brothers by Tom and Henry Herbert
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Post by cannyfradock on Sept 12, 2013 17:26:30 GMT
...nothing to add, except I love reading this thread. Many thanks for the informative posts...and giving credit to the author of original articles.
Thanks guys...
Terry
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Post by tonyb on Sept 13, 2013 8:34:01 GMT
The one bit that doesn't come over very clear is the need to reduce ie use or throw away, some of the starter when feeding but not baking. For instance, at the beginning, you are adding 150g to the starter every day so you need to make sure you have a large kilner jar as you will have accumulated 900g of starter by day 6 Most of the 'recipes' I've seen (and followed),suggest throwing half or so of the starter away each time you feed it at this stage. I suspect they do something similar as the implication of the latter part of their process is that they only keep 75g of starter in the fridge and you wouldn't really want to be keeping that in a large container. A bit nit picky I know but people doing this for the first time need the comfort of fully explicit directions.
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Post by faz on Sept 13, 2013 12:20:46 GMT
This is my tried and tested recipe - quantities are based on Allinsons Strong White flour, other flours may need slightly more or less water.
1. Pot of viable starter kept in fridge 2. 24hrs before baking, make the preferment, using 110g water and 110g flour, plus 1 dessert spoon of starter. 3. After 24 hours, add 280g water, 510g flour and 7g salt, mix well and knead lightly (there is no need to carry out kneading in a way that makes the veins on the side of your head bulge!) 4. Stretch and fold the dough occasionally (once or twice is ok!) as the dough ferments - this helps develop further strength in the dough and also improves homogeneity of temperature within the dough 5. Once the dough is ready shape the dough and place it in a banneton for a final rise 6. Once risen, turn out on to a hot baking tray and bake at 230 deg C for 10 minutes, then 210 deg C for a further 35 minutes 7. Repeat until the starter is nearly empty 8. When there is no longer enough starter left to make a loaf, refresh it by adding equal weights of water and flour to the starter jar (in my smallish kilner jar I add 225g flour, 225g water). If you add too much you may come back to find that your starter is trying to escape the jar and is all over your worktop, dresser etc. 9. Mix well 10. Leave out for 24 hours - the starter should ferment all the added material and become bubbly and a bit thinner. 11. Pop back in the fridge and use whenever you like for baking, starting at step 2 above. 12. Enjoy beautiful additive free bread ;D
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