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Post by allnjms on May 21, 2015 21:01:49 GMT
Hello
My name is James and I am originally from Cardiff.
I am a builder and am looking to build a pizza oven with a bbq next to it. This is new to me so any advice is greatly appreciated.
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Post by rivergirl on May 22, 2015 10:23:09 GMT
Welcome james , I am now in somerset ( via kent and france ) but was from cardiff! Have you got any plans drawn up yet?
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Post by allnjms on May 22, 2015 21:35:15 GMT
Thank you for welcome Rivergirl. I have not got any plans as yet. I have a rough idea in my head what I want to achieve.
I am looking to have a worktop area with a sunken bbq (to create a hotplate/flamegrill surface) and then some sort of pizza oven alongside.
I am trying to source a cast iron type door and firebricks, as well as fire blanket.
This area of building is relatively unknown to me so should be an interesting howbeit daunting one for me.
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Post by rivergirl on May 23, 2015 10:57:38 GMT
I have been searching junk shops and ebay for a cast iron door but they are proving to be expensive. Keep meaning to go to cardiff to look at that huge second hand place... I think it's rose street. Am always on the look out for a junked range! As for firebricks they do them in bristol but I am hoping to have room in the car next visit to France. Canny fraddock is not too far from you and he has built some fab ovens. Are you going brick , precast or cob for your oven?
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Post by allnjms on May 23, 2015 19:53:37 GMT
I am going brick for my pizza oven. I have a mound of solid clay block pavers which were left off a job. These will look nice as a decorative. I was originally, before doing research, going to use these for the oven but have been informed they are not up to task.
The other problem I have is I am so busy I don't have time to go scouring reclaimation yards for these items although there are some good ones in Cardiff.
I have only just poured my concrete foundation at the moment so have plenty of time, well, as much as the wife will let me have. Lol
A quick question, if I may. I have seen pizza ovens built on top of 50mm pressed concrete slabs. Is that efficient or are fire bricks for the base an essential must?
Otherwise I was thinking of casting my own 65mm concrete, steel reinforced, base and building my dome on that. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Post by cobblerdave on May 24, 2015 0:38:08 GMT
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Post by rivergirl on May 24, 2015 12:13:09 GMT
James you couldn't point me in the direction of the reclamation yards could you please. Might have a daytrip to cardiff to scour them.
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Post by allnjms on May 27, 2015 4:15:45 GMT
Thanks Dave for this info. I appreciate you taking the time to post links etc. Unfortunately, my WiFi is down at the moment and my phone won't let me open the link. I will try again once WiFi is back.
There is a reclamation yard just off Rover Way. By the steel works.
there is the pump house on penarth road, which can be quite pricey, however.
I have been told there is also one just off hadfield road but have yet to find that one.
If I find anymore then I will let you know.
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Post by cannyfradock on Jun 4, 2015 17:31:33 GMT
Hello James...welcome to the forum. Try to download the link from Dave from Forno Bravo.....it explains in detail quite a lot from scratch to finished job. (one day we'll have our own plans, mind you....I've been saying that for years!)... The insulation layer between slab and hearth is important. Some use vermecrete (vermiculite, cement and water)...you can also buy ceramic fibre board but I, like many of the builds on this forum have used insulation blocks like "Celcon" on my builds. They've always worked well for me and only cost just over a quid each....and you can cut them with a handsaw. The cheapest fire-brick supplier that I know is Liam from "Kilnlinings"...his bricks are £1.29p each less a 10% discount for forum members. There are other refractory suppliers like Vitcas in Bristol and Castree in Camarthenshire. They both sell all refractory materials needed for a Fire-brick oven build but both companies fire-bricks start at about £2 (ish) each descending to about £1,40 for quantity buying. Kilnlings have to charge delivery at (about £70....not sure exactly) so depending on the amount you want it may be cheaper to collect from Vitcas or Castree (don't forget that each fire-brick weighs about 4.2 KGS). Castree also do reclaimed fire-bricks (not sure on the alumina content...we use 42%)..at about a quid (ish?) each, although I phoned them on Tuesday and they had no (reclaimed) bricks at the moment. If I had a stack of clay pavers, I would use them. The Ruaben clay pavers are a very dense clay product and I've used them on some hearths of Clay oven builds.....they work well....without spalling. Research is your best friend at this stage. Have a look over the Pompeii builds on this.....and the Forno Bravo forum. Welcome on board... Terry n.b....a lot of members have a link to their builds at the foot of their posts....they're well worth clicking on. If you are building a outdoor cooking "station" then my builds may help in your planning. Here's the links to 2 of my builds... ukwoodfiredovenforum.proboards.com/thread/1811/kate-humbles-90cm-pompeii-monmouth ukwoodfiredovenforum.proboards.com/thread/677/terrys-2nd-build-robs-oven (just notices the pics are not working?...her's another.. ukwoodfiredovenforum.proboards.com/thread/1031/pompeii-oven-build-corris-wales |
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Post by allnjms on Jun 5, 2015 22:04:24 GMT
Hey Terry.
Many thanks for your welcome and for the advice.
I might use the block pavers seeing as I have three packs of them and see how they do. I only fear that the efficiency would not be there in hear retention.
I am hoping to cook pizza and then bread in the wfo, howbeit occasionally.
Thanks for the links, the projects look great.
If thermalites work better than vermacrete then I may use them instead. I always have them left over from jobs.
Do you use a fire blanket over the dome or would vermacrete do the same job. I may build it up over a few coats.
Also, thanks for the info ref Liam. Great to know recommended suppliers at great rates.
Thanks again
James
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Post by rivergirl on Jun 7, 2015 13:27:53 GMT
Thanks for that info will be having a look next time I come home!
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Post by allnjms on Jun 12, 2015 21:18:09 GMT
Thanks for that info will be having a look next time I come home! I popped into the reclamation yard in Tremorfa. They had a limited supply of fire bricks priced at £4.00 each +vat. they also had no pizza oven doors of useable quality. |
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Post by allnjms on Jun 12, 2015 21:27:23 GMT
Hey Terry
Thanks for input, appreciate all and any advice.
The pavers I have are not ruabon. They are 65mm thick dense clay pavers. In your experience would these retain the heat ok and not cause uneven cooking. I did prefer to use them but not if they are not up to the job.
I am weighing up the difference between using thermalite blocks or vermiculite mixed with cement under the base. Which is the best way? Either way is easy for me so which would be the most effective?
Many thanks
James
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Post by cannyfradock on Jun 14, 2015 11:02:00 GMT
Hey Terry Thanks for input, appreciate all and any advice. The pavers I have are not ruabon. They are 65mm thick dense clay pavers. In your experience would these retain the heat ok and not cause uneven cooking. I did prefer to use them but not if they are not up to the job. I am weighing up the difference between using thermalite blocks or vermiculite mixed with cement under the base. Which is the best way? Either way is easy for me so which would be the most effective? Many thanks James James To start with I would say that the best bricks to use for a Pompeii oven are 42% Alumina content fire-bricks. There is no reason why your clay pavers won't give even cooking as long as cut the top 3 or 4 courses of the dome bricks so as there is more brick than mortar showing. I would also lay the hearth bricks "on edge" as apposed to flat. WOULD I USE THOSE CLAY PAVERS FOR A BUILD?....for a domestic oven for myself...YES. For a commercial customer or a paying client NO. If they are a dense "CLAY" paver and I had them for free I would definately go for it myself. As for the under hearth insulation I have only ever used insulation blocks. They work and work well but I would say/guess that a 4" vermecrete layer would work better. On my next Pompeii build I shall be using vermecrete for my insulation layer under my fire-brick hearth. (with the 3" fire-bricks laid flat....as normal).....the following build I will use vermecrete and lay the hearth bricks "on-edge" to see if I get more retained heat in the hearth. I always say "I'm still learning" as only by tweaking standard practice can I learn by first hand experience what works best. How much % difference would there be by using clay pavers ....against fire-bricks would always be a guesstimate....I would guess that you would have a -10 or -15% performance from your oven. As long as you have under hearth and over dome insulation, the only difference you may find is that when your cooking pizzas, you may have to rake the coals back over the whole hearth(leave for 20 minutes then push back and carry on baking pizzas) to put heat back into the hearth after a fast loading of perhaps 25 pizzas. A fire brick hearth will do about 40 pizzas before having to do this. This normally wouldn't happen in a domestic situation but in a commercial situation or like me yesterday with a class of 14 students at my Clay oven building course at Kate humble's smallholding farm, the second part of the course was pizza oven baking in my pre-built Pompeii. The 14 students each baked 2 pizzas each plus a Naan each and some Pide flatbreads. There were about 40 pieces of cold flat dough on the same spot in continuous chain....if I had to do another 40 I would have raked the coals back over for 20 minutes or so.   Please take into account James that is my honest opinion of clay pavers....I could be proved wrong!! Terry p.s....I may be interest in buying any clay pavers you have left over. |
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Post by allnjms on Jun 14, 2015 21:26:33 GMT
Hey, thanks again Terry for input.
I am going to go for it and use the clay pavers with a vermacrete base.
There is a small wave on the face and back of the paver to assist with interlocking as they are designed to be laid in a linear format. I will grind these smooth though for my base. I won't be cooking 40 pizzas at a time so should be ok. Prob more like ten max. I am going to try bread though and the occasional chicken.
Once I have finished, I am going to count the number of pavers left. My architect has first choice as he wants some for his garden but if there are any left after, I will let you know.
Work has ground to a halt at present as I have just had to have a new boiler fitted. Ouch. But I plan to continue asap.
it is an exciting project.
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