Vic's Pomeii Oven

[victor]

I have made quite some headway with my Pompeii oven build, and I thought best to give you all an idea of how things are progressing.

Cost has been kept down with the use of reclaimed bricks and some terracotta tiles I had for the sole of the oven, these were laid on old red bricks.
I did splash out twenty five pounds on the old oak beam for the lintel, which I will leave exposed after the render coats.

The base slab is an extension of some existing concrete that was already down no rebar and just one skin of blocks to sides and back, adequate in my view given that the ground is solid (ex lorry park)
and the oven in it's self is not going to have a brick work enclosing it all.

Using old bricks has been tiresome with all the cleaning and sorting, they do have a slight frog to them but should be ok.


Once the dome is complete, I hope to use a 25mm layer of body soluble blanket for insulation and that will also to allow for some movement, before thermalite blocks are cut and laid to the shape of the dome.
Then final render coats are applied.

I am a very slow at typing so please do not expect quick fire answers, but I will do my best to answer any questions that may be asked.

To add I do have building trade experience and my brick work is fair with some talent in associated trades, some would call me a jobbing builder.
I like to think I am something of an artisan trying to preserve a variety traditional skills.



Blocks pre cut ready for laying and tarpaulin put up more to keep the sun off, than rain.



Shuttering in place with 10mm rebar cut to length half filled with concrete then rebar at 6” centres, then more concrete to finish with plenty of tapping on the shuttering to settle the concrete



Thermalite blocks laid for insulation with a rebar and concrete ring
Next episode soon.

Vic

[victor]

I love the idea of the old oak beam, are you going to render and white the base? that would set the oak of nicely I think.

I see whilst you might not have ant pets trying their best to lend a paw in any of the shots you do have a nosey mask face thingy, who has magically jumped up over the base to get a better look

Turkey

Hi Turkey

Yes all the base will be rendered with rounded corners and no sharp angles. I will knock off the corners to achieve this. I will be leaving the beam exposed and adding some rustic doors for the wood store.

The green Man on the wall has always been there as he represents fire amongst other things so I thought it best to leave him there for the time being.

Vic

I am lucky my wife does not pay any interest when I am on the forum or she might decide my slapdash approach does not cut it after seeing all these rather well built ovens and quality work all over the place

Turkey

Hello Vic

Brilliant pics of your build so far.....even this late in the year there are many, many ongoing builds so your photo diary is/will be much appreciated.

If I understood correctly you are going to build your dome then cover it with body soluble blanket......then cover the blanket with thermolite/insulation blocks.....that's a first !!!.....normally we use vermecrete/vermiculite and cement....but thermolite blocks will create the same effect....One shouldn't assume, but I presume you are building another dome structure with the thermolite blocks?.......be careful not to compress the insulating blanket as this will inhibit the blankets full potential.

Looking forward to the next chapter

Terry

Turkey

The good wife says why do I always take the difficult option, but that is just me always looking for a challenge,
the oven certainly has been taxing especially trying to do it on the cheapish.

Terry

As you say I hope to cover over the insulation using light weight blocks cut into quarters and hopefully not crushing the blanket in the process,
I may need some sort of spacers but I am hoping that wont be necessary

Victor

I created the forum so anybody in the UK (and elsewhere) could follow a certain type of build.....and use it as a guide and follow it. The only drawback with that is, 90% of people here seem to go off on a different tangent and add their own special touch...and you seem to be jumping on the same bandwagon of people who want a "bespoke" oven......

.....I love it..... and look forward to seeing your oven come together..

Please post pics and keep us informed of your progress.

Terry

another build to follow! Will keep an eye on this, looks really good so far - you're going to have a massive wood store space under it by the looks of things.

Tapir

Hi Tapir

Yes it is going to be a good size wood store, it was an important part of the build to have the storage
for logs. I was going to have vents on the sides to aid air circulation but it was going to be too much faffing about to cut the blocks
and I was unsure how it would fit in with the design. I probably still will have vents but use a core drill for ease, but we will see.

[victor]

It is going to take some posts to get you up to stage I am at the moment but here is my second stage of the build.
The old red floor tiles I have used for the oven base marked out for cutting, these will sit on top of a layer of bricks to give thermal mass
it is the only part of the build that I have some concerns with in that the mortar layer between the two will hinder heat flow.



Tiles marked out, it was to give me some idea how the lay out would work



Soldier course started I used a thick brown paper cut in a circle for template



First course complete with landing entrance, If I did another build I would leave the landing brick work to later, it gets in the way for working on the dome



Hearth bricks laid ready for tiles



Tiles laid with a thinnest bed I could get, not that easy with the old bricks, all tiles round the edge were cut using templates.

Vic

[victor]

Victor

Great progress on your oven. I'm not sure how you are going to build your dome, but it's a good idea to lay some protective covering on the hearth before you begin.

Terry

Wow Vic, i like it! You're even using some methods that i'd decided to employ too. It's really nice to see a different take on the theme. Keep up the good work fella!

Bookemdanno

With the soldier course complete I start on my first course proper.

Made myself the indispensable tool, but to be honest most of the time I just used it as a guide just to make sure I wasn't too far off with each course.

I needed to adjust it progressively with every other course or so by 0 .25” to get my required dome hight of 16.5” for the 36” diameter oven.

On my second course I did need to think about my entrance arch, aiming for a reasonably shallow arc.



First brick course



Third course nearly complete







Here are some photos of the arch mock up, at the highest point it is 10.5”





Third course complete with arch.

More to follow.

Vic

[victor]

Victor

Nice tidy workmanship.

Terry

It was at this point the dome took on a mind of it's own with regards to shape,

a lot of this was due to the transition from dome to arch and the way I went about it.

I have already said that I only used the indispensable tool for rough brick alignment,

you can see from the photo my three cut bricks I used for the transition,

the centre one is cut like a key stone so it can not fall out.







From this top view you can see that I am getting something of an egg shape,
not the end of the world as I was originally was going to build a Quebec oven that has that type of shape. Or you could call it a beaver tail of sorts.













Next post I hope to get you all up to date.

Vic

[victor]

Wow Victor, this is really amazing! This is just firing me up perfectly! Fantastic work, and a great thread to follow.

I'm very much in two minds now about building my own Pompeii with a traditional feel using Old Red Bricks now, rather than solid Engineering bricks. This would be more in keeping with my Victorian Flint walled House i feel. Only thing is, i'm a bit worried about choosing the right old reds.
Are you able to give me any advice on choosing a suitable old brick, please?

Bookemdanno

I believe you want to make sure they are "pressed reds" these are solid clay bricks.

I think to test you need to hit them and you should get a thud not a clink sound from them, and when you hit them really hard they should crack / crumble and not have sharp bits in them.

Pretty sure that is what I read.

EDIT:

pretty sure this was the thread I read about it

www.fornobravo.com/forum/f2/suitable-pressed-reds-photos-12667.html

Turkey

The bricks I am using are hand made, they are not the later wire cut type which are also fine for an oven build, both are considerably denser and heaver than modern bricks.
But there are a fare amount voids in the bricks I am using, hopefully they are up to the job. But I only paid 35 pence each as opposed to 60 pence from a reclamation yard.
If I was buying bricks again I would split one and see how the inside looked.

Here is a photo of a cut brick, you will see what I mean, they are made up of all sorts.

[victor]

Very nice work indeed, Victor. 5*

Tom B

Victor

Tip top build.....well done !!!...and we appreciate the pictures. Impressed with your final rings of brick and keystone (much neater than mine).

Good technique in the way you cut the bricks in the dome/vent transition, although the natural structure of the dome should prevent any slippage.

Your dome bricks as you say are quite different to fire-bricks but being of a clay compound and having so many voids within the brick may work in your favour in a similar way to some Cob builds where wood chippings are added to the clay so the wood chips will eventually burn out leaving a honeycomb effect......which you already have.

Nice build.......

Terry

re the bricks I assume as they have been kiln fired once any air would have escaped without damage to the brick so I think when you heat it you will also have no issue. You will be sealing some sides of the bricks so there is a slight difference but I do not think it will matter.

What I would assume to be more important would be to seal the outside, and then first firing after any rain to start low and slow to make sure that porus brick is not full of water as steam build up might be more of an issue, but this is good practice for any oven.

lovely looking build, I really like the rustic bricks, coupled with the wooden beam I think the finished look will be more Mediterranean looking and an oven actually in Italy.

Some more photos



showing the thermerlite block for the heat break between the oven and landing













some chimney shots.

Vic

[victor]

Awkward brick cuts first with 9” disk and then a reciprocating brick saw to get the depth.

that saw is a new one for working with bricks, lovely bodging

you should be well chuffed with the brick work, that inner arch to chimney transition looks stunning and a shame its going to be unseen by most.

glad to see the winter has not stopped builds dead, mine is practically in hibernation but seeing others still working has motivated my to get the base down and first row of the bricks. So a double thanks, one for the pics and the other for the motivation

Turkey

[didwri]

Something like this would be great for us.. thanks you for sharing the details.. lovely work

[victor]

Feb 13, 2012 12:04:19 GMT didwri said:

Something like this would be great for us.. thanks you for sharing the details.. lovely work

It has been some time in the making, but I am pleased overall with how it has turned out.
There is still some way to go with a fair amount of work in redesigning the whole garden.

[victor]

Brick cutting was a pain, especially with the old bricks, none of them were square and without a full blown wet brick saw it was always going to be a challenge. The reciprocating saw came into it's own cutting the light weight blocks that were used for the outer dome insulation.

Here are some shots of the dome insulation

[victor]

Vic
That's a wicked build

Tom B

Work has slowed somewhat on the oven due to the weather and being in two minds about how to keep the oven dry.

It would be nice to have a roof over the whole lot and have a bit of shelter from the elements for the cook. I have considered a pitch roof made of cedar shingles, flat clay tiles or slate whilst trying to
keep the whole thing from looking top heavy.

The other options I have thought of is to use Mira tanking membrane, it is a latex coating that has a temperature resistance of -20c to + 120c and either apply this directly to the insulation blocks and then render and leave as is, or render then apply membrane and with a mosaic design finish. I know you can tile over the membrane but I don't know if it will take render. I have heard that you can dust with sand when still tacky and this will give more of a key for the render, but I have yet to find somebody that has tried this.

But oh joy, I have fired the oven and I have been blown away by it's performance and a huge relief that the old bricks and terracotta tiles stood up to the intense heat under full firing and I am so glad I spent the time on designing and building the chimney, it works flawlessly.

I am one very happy bunny Very Happy









And here is the very first pizza, burnt on the under side but I didn’t care



Vic

[victor]

:)Lovely oven - well done
I had missed the pics of using thermolite blocks - what a good idea!
Just one more thing to say - Enjoy!!!

Happy Baker

Well done Vic!
i am very impressed and will be using your build as my guide, if you don't mind.
a truly awesome oven with some great individual touches.

enjoy it!

Bookemdanno

Victor

Congratulations on a brilliant build....and many thanks for sharing.

Didn't fully understand your earlier post about laying thermolite blocks on the exterior of your dome.....now I understand...and it makes perfect sense.

On my next build I'm thinking of using K-rend as a finish waterproof coat on the dome. I would replace the plastic skrim for chicken wire in between the 2 coats.....just another option.

Terry

Thank you for your kind comments.

I will be firing up Wednesday this week and will try baking some bread and then refire that evening for pizzas.

Can anybody point me in the direction of some bread recipes that uses same flour that I use for the pizzas, it is Italian White Flour - Type "00" from Shipton mill or any easy bread recipes?

Victor

500g flour
7g packet of dried yeast
300ml water
1/2 teaspoon salt.
1 tsp sugar

Mix all together in bowl,
tip out onto bench,
Knead with your hands for 15 minutes.
leave to rest with an oiled piece of cling film over it for at least 40 minutes
kneed or "knock back again and knead for 5 minutes.
Put in your tin or just shape into a dome and put on a floured or oiled tray that you will bake it on.
Leave for 40 minutes again then put in your oven for ? in leccy and gas ovens it's 30 - 40 minutes at 220 deg C but WFO I've no experience.

www.bselfsufficient.co.uk/BreadMaking.htm this is a link to my bread making on my site.

I would say that it might be a waste to use 00 flour for bread. You need a really strong flour not a 00 which is good for pasta etc. I use Allinsons premium flour or their strong white flour. Any flour will do but like anything it's down to taste and application.

** I do this in my oven but others may advise not to in a WFO. Proceed with caution. **

When you put your dough in the oven if you throw a cup of water on the bricks it will cause steam which helps with the crust.

** hopefully this will not crack the bricks etc. Don't blame me if it goes wrong Laughing Laughing
HTH,

Alan

I agree with Al not to use 00 flour for standard white bread, better to use a branded strong flour.

TonyB

Thanks for the advice on flour, I used Allinsons strong white bread flour in the end.

Fired the oven up at 2pm on wednesday from cold, it took about 2½ hours to get up to pizza temperature. I had readings of just under 500c on the top part of the dome and about 470c on the lower part of the dome and about 440c on the floor.



The bread went in 1½ hours after cooking the last pizza just a bit too soon for the bread (oven too hot) my timing was out on the dough rising and getting it into the oven at the right time.
It had more than doubled in size and it collapsed on the way to the oven. After only ten minutes of cooking it looked like this.



After 3 hours of the oven cooling down I tried a small loaf made from the left over pizza dough, to my surprise it turned out quite well something like ciabatta I believe.



Vic

[rivergirl]

such a brilliant build and I know you have to but what a shame to cover up all that beautiful brickwork !! I bet that pizza went down a treat 1

[victor]

Mods, not sure if I put this thread is in the right place it's half archive half ongoing?

Vic