adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Apr 16, 2013 9:02:21 GMT
Me again with another dumb question...... If I am going to build a brick Pompeii oven, I would like to do it as best I can using tapered bricks throughout. I already nabbed the brick taper calculator spreadsheet from the FB forum to guide me. So - what would be the best saw type to use to achieve these cuts? I would rather invest in a proper saw than use a grinder of bolster. Chop saw? Mitre saw? Compound mitre saw, double bevel sliding compound mitre saw? Table saw? Something else entirely? In an ideal world, what would be the most beneficial type to achieve the cleanest, most accurate and repeatable cuts? Also, given the copious quantities of brick dust I would expect is there a particular type or make that is more reliable and won't give up the ghost halfway through? Thanks! Alasdair
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Post by johnaero on Apr 16, 2013 10:23:34 GMT
do you have link to that calculator buy any chance or would you email it
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Apr 16, 2013 10:49:12 GMT
Here's the link to the calculator: www.fornobravo.com/forum/f28/dome-spreadsheet-calculator-18131.htmlIt's on the first, of the first page of this thread. It's all in inches, but should be easy to convert to mm if required... Back to saws again, I did a little more trawling around on the FB forum (might have to join that as well) and it seems that many of our US cousins use a 10" tile/brick saw from Harbor Freight: www.harborfreight.com/25-horsepower-10-industrial-tilebrick-saw-69275.htmlNow that looks ideal - anybody know where to get something similar in the UK (without spending the earth?) Failing that, as I travel to the US fairly regularly I could probably pick one up and carry it back as excess luggage. However - the US is all 110V - so would one of these work if I just used it with a regular 110V site transformer?
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Post by johnaero on Apr 16, 2013 11:05:07 GMT
yes i used similar tools with 110v in my last job and worked fine.
check 2nd hand market, get lot ex builder tools on 110v
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Post by turkey on Apr 16, 2013 13:57:02 GMT
I think any of the tools you specified would do it, I used a mitre saw with a diamond blade and it cut very well, but for tapered cuts you will need an easy way to make angled forms to hold the brick at the right angle for the cut. Kingspan sheets are easy to cut and pretty tough so might be worth considering. The issue I found with the mitre saw was the bore of the blades made it very difficult to buy suitable diamond blades, I got lucky in the end and it worked well but this would be one of the considerations, as you could end up spending as much on the blade as the saw..... a 9" grinder and a decent clamp / vice could work just as well. Re dust, I soaked bricks in water for a min before any cut and used a large plant sprayer to cool the blade and wash away the dust, in truth it becomes a stream of clay sludge thrown back from the saw, no dust but plenty of mess and having plastic sheeting or being located not in the middle of the prize lawn are both recommended actions
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Apr 16, 2013 16:15:29 GMT
Thanks Turkey,
Looking at some build diaries (in particular Charlie Farley's), I'm clear that I will need a way to easily adjust the angles for the different cuts for the different courses.
A compound mitre saw should be able to be set up easily enough to be able to make a precise cut angled in two planes simultaneously (which I think is exactly what is needed?), so it would be a matter of making up a jig/clamp arrangement that would hold the bricks precisely in the right place.
Then there's the matter of the blades as you say - I'd probably invest in a very good one up front, but if the bore is different between blades for brick/tile cutting and typical wood mitre saws, then that also needs consideration.
I would be worried all the dust would ruin the saw motor pretty quickly on a wood mitre saw - but then again I could buy a pretty cheap saw and just hope it made it through all the cuts.
I do like the ability to have a proper water stream to keep the dust away though - sadly, most of the tile bridge saws I have been looking at today seem to only manage 35-50mm cut depths, which doesn't sound deep enough. The bigger masonry table saws are out of my price range and there's no way the missus would let me buy one, no matter how much fun it looked. Here's hoping for a second hand bargain!
As for using a grinder......I pretty much hate them! I had a nasty accident with one when I was much younger so I have a very healthy respect/fear of them. For the amount of cuts needed to build an oven I think I want a properly set up table type saw to make accurate cuts and keep all my fingers and toes!
As for the dust on the lawn....oh, I've been there before! She wasn't happy....
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Apr 16, 2013 19:00:13 GMT
Just to add to my own post....been doing a bit more research on saws and came across the Evolution Rage 3 Double Bevel sliding mitre saw: www.evolutionpowertools.com/uk/build/rage3db.htmlThis has a specific diamond blade for it and reviews seem really good. I pinged the manufacturer to ask about suitability for cutting around 250 firebricks and their answer was "no problem - just use the diamond blade". So - this might be a possibility. The double bevel version is about £250 (or £150 on ebay for a manufacturer's reconditioned unit), but they also sell a regular single mitre version which is on offer at Screwfix for £99 and seems to be a decent bargain....
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Post by h12rpo on Apr 16, 2013 20:03:28 GMT
That looks the biz..... Whats the difference between a single and a double bevel?
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Post by johnaero on Apr 16, 2013 21:00:12 GMT
mate and brotherinlaw have thoes saws said they area excellent
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Post by turkey on Apr 16, 2013 21:14:48 GMT
I would guess leans right and left, I have a cheapo and it only leans in one direction, means you have to rotate the bricks instead, a bit of a pain as moving the brick means its harder to line up the second cut, but not exactly a deal breaker. Only really even noticed when cutting bricks on an angle lengthways. I had a £30 compound (i assume) mitre saw and an ebay special for the blade, £10 I think, nice blade tho by norton, the saw had a 30mm bore and that made it very hard to find a blade. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Diamond-blade-180-x-2-x-30mm-abrasive-concrete-slabs-breeze-blocks-norton-/300741077889?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item460590ab81seems there is similar on ebay again for a fiver delivered, I wanted cheap but was also mindful that cutting dense bricks rather than wood will stress the motor and dust / water was likely to go everywhere so ruining a cheapo saw was much better, as it turns out with the water spray it seemed to cut very well. I think a decent saw would really make cutting bricks easy, however the other thing to think about is how to secure the bricks whilst cutting, I held my bricks or left them with just their weight to keep them secure and used my other hand to spray water on the blade, but with taper cuts I am not sure how easy it will be to hold the brick and spray water.
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Post by johnaero on Apr 16, 2013 21:27:37 GMT
lidl saw may be good job if can get blade fit
i have one and will check blade inner size. great saw for price
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Post by johnaero on Apr 16, 2013 21:33:02 GMT
did quick google and the aldi saw i have has a 30mm internal bore but will check blade in morning
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Post by bookemdanno on Apr 18, 2013 19:55:47 GMT
Check the motor speeds and maximum revs that the blades can handle too please chaps!
You don't want one flying to bits now, do you! Ouch!
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adm
WFO Team Player
Posts: 164
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Post by adm on Apr 25, 2013 17:41:43 GMT
I seem to have solved my saw dilemma! I just lucked out on eBay and won a big secondhand industrial diamond blade masonry table saw with an 80+mm cut depth and proper water cooling. This is going to be incredibly useful as I also have a big patio to lay as well as build an oven.
As I haven't even poured my base slab yet, I think I will start work on building a cutting jig and practice cutting bricks....I have a few hundred motley assorted bricks to hand to play with. Sadly no firebricks yet.
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Post by bookemdanno on Apr 26, 2013 16:22:38 GMT
OOOOHHHH....that sounds like such fun!
I love new power tools!
Have fun!
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