Victas pompeii

[lbrod]

Hi everyone!

I was considering buying the Milano 750 from pizza oven supplies. The posts on here are great and the oven looks like just what I'm after.

I have now seen the Victas Pompeii it's internal measurements are 800mm so a little bigger than the Milano. It is a little more pricey, but it looks like the flue/chimney is on the outside of the dome chamber which I think could make it a little better, although it's a 100mm chimney which I'd like to modify to a 5" or 6". I can't find any reviews, videos or posts about it though.

Has anyone built one or seen them in action? Any advice on which one is better would be much appreciated.

Cheers.

[fox]

I think they are two different designs, the Milano is made from a semi insulating mix and will heat up quickly but not hold the heat as long as the Victas Pompeii as that one is made from dense refactory cement.
At least that is what i can gather?
I thought the Victas Pompeii had a five inch flue opening ?
I guess it depends if you want to hold heat for several days to cook bread meat etc or if you just want to cook pizza on one night.
There is another choice, also a traditionnel dense cement wood oven from the wood oven warehouse www.woodovenwarehouse.co.uk/product-category/ovens-for-family-use/

[truckcab79]

Can’t recommend this the Milano highly enough personally though I haven’t owned the victas to compare. As far as heat retention goes mine is built with just the insulation provided. I know quite a few people have added more. It heats up to cooking temp in about 40 minutes and holds heat well. Mine has a 5mm steel door as I built it myself. I’ve never got round to insulating the door but even with that in mind and with the chimney on the ‘wrong’ side of the door I can slow roast on it all night and the oven is still 100 degrees plus the following day. That would be enough for most people but ultimately it’s down to how you intend to cook.

I’d recommend one to anybody in fact I’m about to start building another for a client. It’s being delivered today so watch out for a build thread but don’t expect a quick one as the client is my brother and other booked work means that Im doing it for him on the cheap and as and when I have spare time.

[fox]

That is interesting and certainly praise for the oven.
However a brick oven with decent insulation or even a 60mm thick cast dense oven, will hold heat for three days.
If you want to cook bread or slow cook joints of meat the day after then a dense oven may be a better choice?

[downunderdave]

5 mm uninsulated highly conductive steel door, flue pipe in the oven chamber are both counter productive for retaining heat in the chamber. The nature of refractory materials is such that they are slow to heat and any cast oven will not achieve high temperature in 40 mins. Insulating material added to the castable mix reduces thermal conductivity but also reduces the strength of the resulting casting. IR temp measuring devices only reading surface temperatures. How many other ovens and designs have you fired for comparison?

[truckcab79]

Sept 21, 2020 4:30:39 GMT downunderdave said:

5 mm uninsulated highly conductive steel door, flue pipe in the oven chamber are both counter productive for retaining heat in the chamber. The nature of refractory materials is such that they are slow to heat and any cast oven will not achieve high temperature in 40 mins. Insulating material added to the castable mix reduces thermal conductivity but also reduces the strength of the resulting casting. IR temp measuring devices only reading surface temperatures. How many other ovens and designs have you fired for comparison?


None I assure you.😂 However the OP was looking for advice from anyone who has actually built or used either oven. Im not sure if you have or not?

Ive built the Milano and used it for two years so I’m happy to vouch for it. I mentioned the chimney position in my post and of course you’ve seen my thread so will be aware that the door was built by myself. POS make an insulated version if you prefer. 

‘Pizza Oven Supplies’ unsurprisingly make ovens that are primarily for pizza and realistically that’s what the vast majority of us use them for. I fired mine up again yesterday.  40 minutes to cooking temperature and knocked out a quick 8 pizzas. It’s done 30 on a regular basis and they take 60-90 seconds to cook. I’ve also used it for roasts and bread. Excellent results from both. 

I can’t comment on the Victas because I haven’t built or used one. I did look at them when I was shopping for mine and while they looked much more ‘crisp’ in their casting finish they were substantially more expensive and the reviews I read suggested that they had some build issues (same as I did with my Milano).

Its worth a chat with the guys at POS. I found them incredibly helpful both before and during my build.  


Worth checking lead time too. I’ve just waited 10 weeks for the next one to be delivered due to a backlog in orders, Covid and new moulds.

I’ll post some pics when I see it. It’s currently at my Brothers who is the ‘client’ I’m building it for.  

[downunderdave]

Truck cab,
You are quite correct I have not built or fired either the Milano or Victas ovens. My comments refer to general experience from design, refractory knowledge and over a decade of oven building experience as well as kiln building experience.
The second and third ovens I built had their flues in the oven chamber and while this has the advantage of greater floor real estate, I came to the conclusion that its poorer circulation as well as higher heat loss overrode the advantage. I now exclusively build ovens with the flue at the front, independent of the oven chamber. This also does away with the requirement of a valve in the flue pipe.
The addition of an insulative aggregate in the mix to form the castings is a little more complex. It will reduce the heat up time because being less conductive the fire will heat the chamber faster than using its energy to heat the more conductive and dense higher thermal mass mix. Getting the most suitable proportion is the trick. Most builders subscribe to the dense/strong mix backed up with decent insulation. If the oven cooks your roasts ok I guess it is relying to a fair extent on the high thermal mass of the floor bricks.

[fox]

I must say i just dont get it!
I cant see the logic in building a 4’’ thick oven from semi insulating material?
Surely a 2’’ thick high mass dome with 2’’ of high tech insulation makes far more sense?

[lbrod]

Thanks for the advice guys.

Originally I was only going to be cooking pizzas, but as I look into it more I like the look of some other dishes. I don't want to go to the expense of building something that might not be able to retain the heat as well as others for not much more money.

Fox coincidentally I have been looking at the Linea vz Napoli from Wood oven warehouse. It looks like a great oven and quite a bit cheaper than the Victas.

I guess for my level of cooking they are all going to be great.

[fox]

I have bought a precast Napoli oven and almost finished building it for a customer.
This is the first pre cast oven i have bought as i was previously build my own from my own mold So i can only judge it against my own
ovens!
It went together ok but not quite perfect and the landing piece was not quite the same thickness as the floor pieces.
The interior has a few air voids from the casting and the exterior is also pitted !
Overall it seems solid and i dont see any reason it will not perform very well.
The pieces are solid, thick, heavy and dense but not a perfect finish .
The oven came quickly and was well packed, I managed to get it all together and in place in a few hours but you will need help as the components are very heavy!
To be honest as a professional builder I probably would not buy another one as the internal finish is not as good as i expected but they do seem to be very good value .

[lbrod]

Hi Fox,

Reading quite a few reviews on different ovens I think that the quality of finish is an issue all  pre-casts have.

One of the things that I like about the Napoli is the use of high alumina, something I haven't found a lot of in ovens in my budget, others I see are made of more of an insulating material.

The base to that oven your building looks fantastic!

[fox]

Well the company who makes them has been doing so for 40 years so. I guess they must work ok!
I have a better picture that shows the finish issues but i must point out that i still think the oven represents very good value.

[fox]

I dont have any up to date photos of that particular oven but most the casting is no longer visible as it now lives undef about two tons of granite ......

[lbrod]

Hi Fox,

I know its a long time since our conversation, but I've finally got round to my build. I bought the Linea vz Napoli.

I just have a few questions that you might be able to help me out with.

I wondered if it would be a good idea to put fire bricks on top of the supplied floor. I don't really know if it would need it? I spoke to the supplier and they said it is good enough without but putting them on wouldn't hurt. I don't really want to do it for a couple of reasons, height and extra work etc. But I don't want to kick myself after the build.

How have you found yours?
Does the floor get hot enough for pizzas and hold that heat?
How long does it retain the heat roughly?

Many thanks

[fox]

There is absolutely no need to add bricks on top of an already high mass floor, in fact it would be completely counter productive!
Why would you want to do that?
If you wanted a brick floor you could replace the supplied refractory floor but to what avail I dont know ?

What you need is good insulation under the supplied floor and over the dome.

The oven I bough was for a customer and it works very well although it was a very expensive build, it holds heat for a long time and in fact takes four days to return to ambient temperature.
I have a basic build video but i keep meaning to update it ....

youtu.be/RxTxKuu0f-k